Newbie poster here.

I'm considering getting into some long range tactical shooting (out to 1000 yards) and have a question about how much elevation adjustment I need in a scope.

If I choose one of the Leupold Mark 4's it has about 60 inches of elevation. Is this equivalent to 60 MOA? I'm considering a rifle in .308, which has somewhere between 230 and 260 inches of drop at 1000 yards. Is this equivalent to 23 and 26 MOA? Would I need a canted base for a 308 @ 1000Y

The catch here is that the rifle I'm considering (SIG SSG-3000) has a milled in euro dovetail on the receiver, and no one makes a third-party base for it (SIG offers a Warne base that converts it to Picatinny). And I've yet to find anyone who offers a 20 MOA canted base at all.

If any of you guys have this SIG and shoot it at 1000Y I'd love to get some feedback regarding overall performance as well.

Thanks

Matt

I'll leave the technical stuff to someone that knows more than me But yes, you would need a scope base with a 20-MOA cant. That gives you more room to play with as far as the scope goes. I generally shoot between 200-300 meters so I use a 0-MOA level scope base.

Edited: Canted bases are easy to find, most good companies have them. IOR, TPS and Ken Farrell have them.

Your getting a Sig 3000 as your first long range weapon? Must be nice...
You know how much they cost right?

I looked this up for you:
The SSG 3000 uses U.S. quick-detachable bases and rings, in particular, Warne Q.D. Premier mounts (Weaver-style) along with an optional Weaver Rail adapter.
If you were add an additional 20moa base you would be way far away from the reciever. And you want to be as close to the reciever as possible.

Most places that sell the SSG 3000 sell them as package units---
Level III (which is what you are talking about) comes with Leupold Mark 4 M1 10X40mm Mil-Dot Scope, Harris Bipod and case, $4,500.00 (sugg. ret.)

For that price you can easily have a bolt action (w/ Mauser-type bolt if that's your thing) made from the ground up! For you by your own personal Smith!!! For that price you'll have a tool that will out shoot you everyday of the week and twice on Sundays!

My impression of this rifle is that, its packaged as a LE type tool (i.e. 100-600 yards) -- it's not really designed to shoot out to 1K... I may be wrong about that, but I dont see why I would be.

But if you are still set on it, I'm thinking that with the MK 4 scope you will have enough MOA to get you out there...
I know my Nikon will...

Thanks,

Yeah, I've got a budget around 4K to put it together. I'm also considering a Rem 700 in Win Mag, but don't know if I can be patient enough to wait for all the parts (McM stock, etc) to come together, and they've got a SSG in my local gun shop that I've handled. Its very nice. All signs point to forcing myself to be patient and to order all the parts for the 700.

matt

http://snipersparadise.com/sniperstore/gasp2005/gasp.htm

Your in luck-- I think I read something about a 12 week turn around...

I am a bit curious. If you are using a .308 Win with an initial zero of 100 yards, and only experiencing 230 to 260 inches of drop in 1K yards you must be kicking it pretty hard.

What is your bullet type, weight, and velocity? Your powder and your charge weight is of interest also.

Basically, 1 MOA is equal to 1.047" at 100 yards and 1 MOA would then equal about 10.47 inches at 1000 yards. This would mean that you would have to crank up about 24.8 MOA to get your 260 inches. If your scope's reticle adjustment for elevation is centered at your zero of 100 yds, and has 50 MOA adjustment total, you will max it out in the "up" and be at limit of travel to go 1K yds. This will severly cut your windage adjustment to basically zip. Better tip it 20 MOA and be at the bottom of your elevation travel at your 100 yds zero, where you do not need too much windage adjustment, because you will not have it. When you then go to 1K yards, you are up 25 or so MOA, about 1/2 of your scopes total travel of 50, and that puts your elevation adjuster in the middle of its total travel. Hey, there you have your maximum windage travel where you need it., at the 1000 yard line.

Hope this helps.

HB

That's why I said that gun is not designed for 1K shooting the built-in base makes it rough to add another 20moa-- because he would have to use the adaptor on the euro dovetail to make it weaver --- than add on another 20moa---dont you think that would make his scope sit really high... and far from the bore?

The gun is designed for LE use...

ethernectar,
Welcome to Paradise sir! First you will need more the 24 MOA from a 308 win. it will be more like 34 to 38 MOA. It the scope has 60 moa of elevation it should work but you would be better off to install a 20 MOA bases. That way you will keep the scope more optically centered. That will put less stress on the scope.

If you need help please ask, that what we all are here for!


flea

If that's the case I'd get a different rifle and spend the rest on a super nice scope. I've seen these SSG's, very nice rifles but for half the price you can get a better 1000yd rifle and have enough cash left over for the scope of your choice.

Ethernectar,

Again -- Welcome to Paradise.

Patience is a virtue - I suggest you develope some. For what you have described it would appear that it is an LE design, and considering the cost I agree that you would be better off building you own rifle --- especially to get to 1000M/yds.

For all the reasons listed above the 20MOA is highly recommended if your trying to get 308 out to 1000 with out haveing to use holds. As your reticle is moved to the edge of the lens capabilities the higher liklehood that imperfections in the glass will cause errors. It is most desireable to have the crosshairs closer to the mechanical zero of the scope as the longest ranges to take advantage of the quality of the glass.

The height of your scope off the receiver, based on what is currently on the market is moot (not relevent) even with the highest rings available. As the scope is mounted higher off the receiver the crossover point of the trajectery of the bullet is changed i.e.: with a low mounted scope a 100 yard zero the bullet is still rising above the line of sight. When the bullet comes back into the line of sight it may be equivelently zeroed for 325 yards too. As the scope is mounted higher and higher the initial angle of the barrel increased so as to be zeroed at 100yds. This means that the trajectery of the bullit is steeper and therefore when the bullet in its decent will cross the line of sight further out --- maby 400 yds. Most reloading manuals and trajectory zero charts are based on the standard scope mount elevation. Finding charts for your particular load (ammuition configuration) may be difficult, and is only a guidline anyway. The solution to the problem is to use real distance or absolute zeros for each 100M/yds. Mark the appropriate number of clicks in your log book or place tape around your turret and mark the exact point at which each zero is achieved. The latter is my perfered method -- at known distances I don't need to count clicks ----- just dial it in a squeeeeeeezzzz.

If your serious about 1000 + I recommend a different munition: 300WM, 408, 438 etc. The 308 can do it, but the larger calibers are more effieicent.

Hope this helps,

SSG

VErn is right with the drop figures from a 308 unless you were shooting my green mortor.

45 MOA to 1000 yards from 100 yard zero.

SIGARMS and USO sell adapter bases. I don't think either of them are 20 MOA though.

If you want an awesome shooting stick, one that very few folks have, and will shoot as good as the very best and better by far than most, here ya go:

http://snipersparadise.com/sniperchat/inde...?showtopic=7753

Best thing is, there are currently 2 in stock that are already built and ready to ship!

Once these are gone, this deal is gone and to order one later will cost you much more.

While I am a fan of the SSG3000, I would agree with the other folks and sway you from buying it. It has great ergonomics and shoots like a dream - 1/2 to 3/4 MOA any day. But, it is a little quirky. The flash hider that comes on it is not well thought out. It is rather long and the closed bottom design holds water. This is a huge problem if you are shooting in the rain, as I found out the hard way. Even a few drops of water in it will significantly throw off your point of impact - in my case, almost 6" low at 100 yds! Not a big problem if you control the where and when of your shooting. Big problem if you have to go where the action is. Bottom line? Your money could be better spent.

Yeah, after doing more research I've decided to go with a Rem 700 long action in Win 300 Mag. Just have to decide if I want to drop the Gs on a setup that I'm only going to have the opportunity to shoot once a month at the distance it was intended for.

m