Has any one shot a weatherby .338-.378 mag. I'd like to know your opinion on it, plus is that caliber allowed in bench rest competion?

I am not familiar with this particular round. As far as Benchrest goes, again I don't shoot it but I don't think there is any limit on caliber as long as the range doesn't have any limits. Hopefully someone else can point you to the rules and verify that.

The 338-378 is suitable and legal for 1000 yard benchrest. If you can stand the recoil, and the expense.

Like most other calibers, it's accuracy is more depndant on quality of the gun it is fired from than anything else. There are those who don't care for a belted case, and I am one of those, or for the venturi shoulder.

The drawbacks are expense from:

1. Ammunition. Brass is expensive and only available from Norma. Norma manufactures Weatherbys loaded ammunition and that is certainly no cheap for 338-378. Reloading isn't cheap either, at 100 grains of powder or more each shot. Match bulleets currently run about 205 dollars per 500 for Sierras.

2. Barrels. Burning 100 grains of powder or more for each shot will errode a barrel fairly fast. Figure at best 2000 rounds, 1500 more likely. About 500 bucks to start to install a match grade barrel.

This is on top of the expenses of building a suitable rifle. There is not much of an aftermarket available for this caliber and actions that can be readily chambered in it. And 1000 yard benchrest is about the only competition it might be suitable for. Regular 100 and 200 yard bench rest are pretty much out of the question, not because you couldn't shoot a 338-378, but because you would have no chance of winning. Any 6mm PPC on the line would best you because the recoil is too heavy to shoot in the .1s or .2s.

THanks Rust,

I do reload,what I'm looking for is to get into 1000yd bench rest ,so got any suggestions,on rifle to build?I come in and read Q&A, and all forums,getting alot of great ideas.Also thinking of a 50 cal.but would like second option.

I suppose that unless you have a lot of money for something like a Nesika or Hall, the best bet would be a Remington. Pretty simple choice really.

There is every sort of aftermarket goody imaginable for the Remington: stocks from McMillan, HS Precision, Elk River etc.; triggers from Shilen and Jewell; scope bases with 10 and 20 minute offsets from Badger, Nightforce and others, titanium firing pins and spring sets. The list goes on.

The hard part is picking a caliber. Even a .223 will get you out to 1000 yards. This past year a .223 came in 4th at the Wimbledon 1000 yard match using I believe the 80 gr Sierra Match Kings or a similar bullet. Ballistic coefficient gets it done at 1000, not initial velocity. So any caliber with a ballistic coefficient greater than .500 ought to be worth considering.

The new Winchester short magnum will probably get real popular real fast, as will wildcats based off of it. Plenty of 30 call bullets with big BCs.

Granted, the .338 Sierras have a phenominal BC, and a few others like Lost River claim even bigger BCs. The trick there is what actions are available as well as what cartridges for .338.

I settled on a .338 RUM as a project. The ballistics are virtually the same as the .338-378, it uses a long Remington action or an express length Winchester action so it doesn't take anything exotic. Ammo and brass are less expensive. And especially for the Remington there is an aftermarket. I have Redding dies for it.

It is a lighter rifle so the recoil is up there. Try a day of load developement after sixty rounds you will probably be ready for a break. By the time I get this one figured out it will be time to rebarrel. Maybe a Lothar Walther, I keep hearing Celt talk them up and it sounds intrigueing.

Developement is easier with a lighter caliber however. Something to consider. It also ate the first two sets of scope rings, it now has Mk 4s on top.

As far as .50s, there is a fellow that hangs out here by the handle of triggerfifty and he is the one you should ask about that, he seems to know a little about fifties and I sure don't. Maybe some day after I get these current projects sorted out.

Thanks again;

I did talk to triggerfifty , and he has given me alot to think about,as you have. We disgusted alot of calibers ,that I'm researching now. I'm even considering a 30-06 to build up, might not be want I'm looking for but I'm going to try some different loads, to see what I get. The .338 Lapua has my interest also.So I've got alot of home work to do.

Here is a thought on the 30-36. A number of years back, the high power shooters were having a little debate over whether or not the then brand new .308 was inherently more accurate than the venerable 30-06. For the 30-06 they used a competitors rifle that was considereed to be one of the four or five best rifles in the country at the time against a well made similar rifle in .308. This was done because the .308 was showing signs of being a more accurate round. Well, the .30-06 lost. Shorter powder column and all.

The physical design of the case itself matters. That is why, as shorter, fatter cases came along, the preceding long ones fell into disuse. The .300 Winmag vs the .300 H&H. Even the .300 Weatherby was a better round than the H&H because of it's improved shape and the fact that it held a lot more powder got everyones interest too.

To build a match grade rifle, you would be hard put to beat the new .300 short magnum. I have a couple of RUMs in .300 and .338. I keep hearing about them being barrel burners and all but I seldom load to max velocity, I load to best accuracy. This results in less pressure and less barrel errosion. So I can easily exceed the velocity of a .300 Winmag at a much lower pressure while at best accuracy. And I'm even working at low pressure loads at 100 percent load density. There is one powder that allows me to do this, AA8700. Still in the tinkering stages and I have to head out to a power plant to earn a living so it's going to stay in the tinkering stages a little longer.

One thing to keep in mind, when the shooter himself is removed from the equation, about 90 percent of the accuracy comes from the rifle itself, the rest from matching a load to the rifle. Some of the groups posted at Celts web site are very impressive with out of the box ammo. The load matching might come in at the 600 yard line or longer because what works fine out to 300 or 400 might start fading at 600 or 700. Ballistic coefficient is the deal at extended ranges.

Mt biggest problem is not having a range past 200 yards locally. We're working on it but no success so far.

Hey Rust,
The reason I'm doing the 06,is because I have a model 70 action now. I know ballistic, and bc have every thing to do with accuracy,something the 06 does not have, but I was thinking about putting a 30" match grade Douglas barrel on it. I think that might help some.

Well, I don't see why having a M70 action requires that you chamber it to 30-06. You could chamber it to whatever you want. Nothing wrong with the 30-06 either for that matter.

Right now, if I were to start a new project, it would likely be a .260. I think it will catch on a lot faster in the next year or so.

Otherwise, just as long as you're happy with what you've got, why worry about it?

Thanks Rust;

Good point! There are a lot of calibers that head space the same as an 06, and building the rifle up I can use any cal I want, but will the same bolt work on a different cal.? If so I might then go to a 300 wm., or larger if possible.

The cartridge head diameter is larger for the belted magnums than the -06 family. A smith could open the bolt face up to fit but at that point I figure just buy another bolt.

Another consideration would be to go to an Ackley Improved chamber. You would still be able to use standard 30-36 ammunition but once fireformed the brass will hold about an extra 10 percent more powder and the shape will give somewhat better combustion. You should end up with a 150 FPS more velocity out of a 24 or 26 inch barrel with heavier bullets and the right powder.

I have one rifle in 250 Savage Ackley Improved that is a sweetheart. Of course it is put together right too but it has shown all the good things improving the chamber is supposed to do.

I had always thought that any smith should be able to proberly chamber for and Ackley Improved chamber since it is really rather simple but I was wrong. I have actually seen two rifles that were not correctly rechambered. A correct AI chamber required the barrel to be set back one thread because the chamber will be about .004" shorter and just reaming out the chamber with no setback will not clean it up entirely. So a normal 30-06 go gauge would be a no go gauge in a 30-06 AI chamber, the bolt should not close on it.

Now there are those who will say it's no big deal and a slightly longer chamber will work BUT if you had a sloppy factory chamber to begin with you could end up with a real ugly chamber around the shoulder and with too much headspace you would really be working the brass during fire forming. Seen that.

So if you go that rout make sure the guy doing the work understands what he is doing. Always better to get quality right off the bat.

By the way, an extra long barrel requires that you bed the barrel a few inches out from the reciever. Awhile back there was a thread over on the old shooters board about barrel profile vs barrel stiffness. As it turned out, if you left the barrel at or close to reciever thickness a couple of inches out from the reciever with no taper, it would substantially stifffen the barrel and bed very nicely. I would probably go with something close to a Remington varmint taper profile from there, except a little thicker.

Well, one of these days I'll have exactly what I want at the end of one of my little projects.

O.K. Rust Thanks,

Now I've got something to go with. I know what your saying about the chamber, I've heard of it before , so I'm planning on doing that. Bedding the the length of barrel channel is something ,that I'm thinking about too. But are you saying I only need to bed a little past receiver? What cal. bolt should I look for?

Jeff; You will have to be a little more specific. What caliber do you plan on building around and what action?

As far as bedding goes with what I had previously mentioned, I would bed under the non tapered portion of the barrel. I would leave about four or five inches of the barrel non tapered. This has an additional benefit as it reduces the amount of leverage the barrel has to torque load the reciever with its weight.

If you use a barrel with taper, I probably wouldn't bed past four inches. But if you are going to have a barrel installed you might as well have it with whatever taper profile floats your boat as it shouldn't add substantially to the cost anyhow.

Hi Rust;

I'm going to rebiuld an 06, I was planning on makeing a .338 lapua out of it, model 70. But gunsmith told me not a good idea , said after machining, there would be alot of metal removed from action, and it may not handle pressure well enough. I'm still going to build .338, as soon as I find the action I need.

Thanks,

Jeff

Jeff; There are a couple of advantages to the Model 70. The main advantage is that the action is stiffer than the Remington 700. The fact that it does not have the recoil lug between the barrel and receiver can be of benefit too.

For a Model 70, I would probably prefer a McMillan stock. Plenty of other aftermarket for it also. Plus most folks go with the Remington so you would have something a little different. Set a trend, don't paint it black.

For load data, try finding one of the highpower threads. Some of the highpower guys are reasonably helpful and the 06 has been pretty well developed.

Over on the HuntAmerica board, one of the moderators goes by the handle OKShooter. He has his own Oehler 43 with strain gauges and has developed a reloading manual for the 30-06 using three different rifles. It is 300 pages, the most extensive load manual for a single caliber I have ever heard of. By the way, this guy knows what he is doing too. You can contact him and see about getting a copy from him. Worth checking out.

As far as anything in .338 goes, you might be better off going with the .338 Ultra. The Lapua offers somewhat better performance but not by much. A Remington Sendero-SF (stainless fluted) can be had for about $750 or a little less if you shop around. It comes with the HS Precision stock. Loaded ammo is half the price of .338 Lapua ammo. I know of a shop that carries .338 Lapua and it was around $85 a box. I got a deep discount on my .338 RUM ammo for $32 a box, retail is about $50. Expensive but still less than the Lapua.

Of course, there will be .338 RUM brass on the market shortly.