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  • Old does not mean obsolete

    It seems everything today has to be the most latest, "we have to have predator electronic cammies that look super bad..." this rifle has to adjust for the wart on my shoulders and transform to a giant robot that'll kick the bad guy's butt for me...". Well [attachment=16711:bsflag.gif]

    If you have a HMMWV carrying you, you're huge Ninja Turtle armored suit, a mess hall, repair shop and 300 lbs of batteries the new stuff isn't bad. If you loose the bolts from your adjustable Super-Wiz-Sniper butt stock, no sweat GI there's more in the HMMWV next to your turkey dinner and mashed potatoes. Batteries for you Predator camo they're in there, your Laser Rangefinder/Ground Surveillance Radar/ Kindle Book Reader with boot knife and little brass whistle...they're in there. Life is good, even your 'little commando' jammies with the HI loft feet sewn on are there in the HMMWV, war is hell.

    Then one day some wise guy says there's some crap going down in a strange little country in Asia...dammit, so much for those Farsi lessons and that cool bedside 'puter you bought for your barracks. Sure hope they have Wi-Fi for my tunes and stories.

    Welcome to a real war with a real military that matches you in most ways, no rednecks with rusty AKs. Now there's artillery, bad guy aircraft, tanks, missiles, and millions of screaming, fanatic, little infantrymen all trying to ruin your whole day. The only way to suppress all the thousands of artillery sites those nasty little bastages will be firing at YOU is to go in and chase them out of all those tunnels...what into to tunnels in the mountains the enemy owns? Won't the little bastages chase you with tanks, mech infantry and their own SOF? Ah yep. But can't we get resupply from the air? ah nope, those little bastages have really nice anti aircraft units and lots of ammo...oh yeah, those AAA guns can also rip a HMWWV into confetti, so don't be looking for them for supplies or transport in the little guy's backyard. Ain't gonna happen...So be ready to CARRY all you need for your mission, if it ain't in your ruck...you ain't got it nor will anyone deliver it to you and if you break it or loose part of it it's just junk...maybe hi-tech but hi-tech junk.

    To the chase, old school still rules. As we unloaded some gear for a nice walk on a crisp fall day it hit me. this is the same stuff I've carried for years. Colours and patterns may change but it's the same...
    [attachment=16712:1.JPG]

    Take the SWS here, a bolt rifle with a normal butt stock no fancy adjustable features with nuts and bolts to fall off...no small arms repair shops in these mountains...
    [attachment=16713:2.JPG]

    What a concept a rifle and a drag bag, neither new or a golly gee wiz gadget present on either...heck the DB is even in, gasp' WOODLAND camo
    [attachment=16715:4.JPG]

    Funny how even that terrible woodland and a "plain' stock seems to blend in
    [attachment=16716:6.JPG]

    Just a plain old fashioned rifle...that shoots 3/8" GROUPS at 200 meters all day and all night, that's a GROUP of 3/8 INCH at 200 meters, they all touch at 200 meters, ne?
    [attachment=16717:9.JPG]

    While on the subject of laser range finders. A concession to modern battlefield conditions is the 40LTC-ARD "Kill Flash" that tames those nasty lasers used on the little bastages tanks and other demonic machines. Oh and he also uses the LCMSs boiled eye balls sux....wouldn't leave Paju without it
    [attachment=16718:10.JPG]

    here's a view of the 40LCT-ARD near on axis, kills flash too, what more could you want
    [attachment=16719:11.JPG]

    There's the story, this rifle has been there done that for years. it's not a 'computer" designed weapon system made by a one eyed redneck gunsmith on a dark moonless night with the latest golly gee Gucci parts. it's a plain old bolt rifle that puts it bullets where you want them time after time in any weather in any climate. it has nothing to loose that will lessen it's capabilities. It's always completed it's mission without fail. And it's deniable LOL, much like it's operator it's old school, non flashy and deniable. Soo-jin is a shooter in every definition of the word and calls this old rifle "supernatural", lol, maybe.

    Just some food for thought, getting new stuff is nice but...

    Take care...Jim


    Attached Files
    "A FAMILY THAT STANDS TOGETHER AND FIGHTS TOGETHER STAYS TOGETHER" The combined Dutch Family...


    "But I've a rendezvous with Death, at midnight in some flaming town, when spring trips north again this year, and I to my pledge word am true, I shall not fail that rendezvous"

    Alan Seeger, KIA Belloy-en-Santerre 4 July 1916, Legion Entrangere, American poet.



  • #2
    Nice. KISS. Keep it simple stupid. Words to live by.
    " If you want peace,prepair for war "- Imi Lichtenfeld
    '' I don't like to fight, I like to win!" -Me

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    • #3
      +1
      In the Jungle, On the hunt, I am The Ghost in the Darkness

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      • #4
        Good words from a tried and true sage!!!!
        I stand with Israel !!!!!!!!!!!
        "Dogs best friend"
        "Every dog needs a friend"
        "Tyranny is but a mask that evil wears. Those who fail to perceive it as such, or perceiving it for what it is and deny or ignore it, are destined to be ruled and destroyed by it."
        "Good wife, good sons, good dogs, good guns, what more could one ask of life?
        " 'REAL WARRIORS NEVER CRY ' but it is permissible for their eyes to sweat from time to time"
        " Anyone who doesn't like dogs or guns, is a person never to be trusted!"
        (All the above, Yours Truly
        The only movement to which I want to belong is the bowel movement

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        • #5
          Word!
          XX-Special Forces Assn. (MN
          Retired Deputy Sheriff
          SSG Airborne Inf. (Ret

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          • #6
            'rednecks with AK's'

            I think I represent that remark!

            If it helps, almost all of my bags are ALICE packs and I'd rather have them than any MOLLE gear that I was issued. Seems some wise a** thought that it was prudent to take all the stuff you were gonna put inside the pack, and hang it on the outside. Good thinking chief.
            ?Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everyone you meet."
            General James Mattis, USMC

            "It is easy to kill someone with a slash of a sword. It is hard to be impossible for others to cut down."
            Yagyu Munenori

            "A man's got to have a code, a creed to live by."
            John Wayne

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            • #7
              Must have missed the OP when it was new, or skimmed it and missed pertinents.

              Unless I miss the gist of the originating thread, there is an implication that the current war we have been fighting in the Middle East is not against a worthy adversary and that our troops can't operate without their whizz-bang gear.

              If this is what was meant, and not a misunderstanding on my part, it's a load of crap and impugns our military, their capabilities, and the outstanding job they've done.

              Every generation of warriors has looked upon the next generation and scoffed at the new equipment and comforts they didn't have in "their day". This is understandable, to a point.

              Every generations war has its own set of issues to deal with, just as every enemy does. It is unfair to say that the troops at Agincourt had it harder than the troops at Waterloo, who had it harder than the troops in the Ardennes or Belleau Woods, who had it harder than the troops at Normandy or Guadalcanal, who had it harder than the troops at the Chosin Reservoir, who had it harder than the troops at Hue City, who had it harder than the troops in Fallujah. Complete bullshit.

              I like the KISS principle myself, but can't fault troops who have to use the gear they are issued, and only that gear.......who have no say in what armor they wear, or whether or not they wear it.........no choice in the weapon and ammo they use.

              Jim, I've seen you post of plenty of high-tech gear that you use, NV and the like, that my Grandpa didn't have at Guadalcanal or the Chosin Reservoir. I'm sure your not wearing sateen greens as your combat uniform and wearing a steel pot, either.

              The adversaries we've been fighting have been fighting most of their entire lives. They're wily, capable of great bravery and fighting on their home turf for what they feel is right. That makes them a truly dangerous foe. The mujahadeen in Afghanistan forced the Soviets out of their country, just like the VC and NVA forced warriors of your generation out of Vietnam. They cannot be thought of as "rednecks with AK's" with any seriousness.
              www.precision-applications.com

              It's knowing that when I get up in the morning and my feet hit the floor, the Devil says, "Shit! He's awake!"

              Shortly before World War I, the German Kaiser was the guest of the Swiss government to observe military maneuvers. The Kaiser asked a Swiss militiaman: "You are 500,000 and you shoot well, but if we attack with 1,000,000 men what will you do?" The soldier replied: "We will shoot twice and go home."

              "There are so many Russians, and our country so small, where will we find room to bury them all?" - anonymous Finnish soldier

              Comment


              • #8
                Shep beat me to my response. I do however, have a few words to convey on the matter. To imply that our warriors from the recent conflicts are not fighting a "real war" and are facing an unworthy adversary or "rednecks with AK's", as it was put, is a huge indignity to all who have fought in the recent wars, not to mention those who have fallen.

                I usually do not get into these disputations, but I'll be damned if I will let anyone, veteran or not, cheapen the losses and sacrifices of our nations warriors.

                I could not care less if you insult me and what I have done, come at me all you want, but I have a hard time with someone spewing comments like these, whether it was truly meant or if was an attempt at satire, against the brothers that I have served alongside of, some of which have lost limbs, some have lost a quality of life because of unseen wounds, and some of which, lost all. They did not sacrifice life and limb in anything less than a "real war."

                Semper Fidelis
                "I love the Corps for those intangible possessions that cannot be issued: pride, honor, integrity, and being able to carry the traditions for generations of warriors past."
                Cpl Jeff Sornig, USMC; in Navy Times, November 1994

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                • #9
                  Hi Shep;

                  You missed the whole point of the article. The point of the article is you do not need the latest most Gucci trash to fight. The weapons at hand are more than able to do the job. We've watched tons of money wasted on "new" calibers, new rifles none of which is an improvement to what is already in the system, just wasted money that is getting in very short supply with the current administration. And yet again they want to waste more money on uniforms...we need new camouflage 'cause this don't work, camouflage on a uniform is no more effective than the old OG 107's, it's a moral thing not tactical to have a "badazz camou suit". IF IT AIN'T BROKE WHY FIX IT?

                  Having been there from day one until not to long ago, I respect the troops serving in the Middle East, they have a hard job. The unfortunate thing is it's truncated the military's ability to fight a "normal" war involving armies with the same capabilities as we have, tanks, artillery, airpower and the rest not seen there. We see like the most "beloved" aircraft the A-10 being relegated to popping pick up trucks there, when the military on the DMZ will be facing heavy tank/armor assaults when the balloon goes up, so let's waste them where the dusty conditions will destroy them...brilliant thinking.

                  As to what I use, I use technology such as NODs, lasers, comms gear and such. But I am comfortable operation in OG 107 instead of Multicam, helmet well I prefer a patrol cap or a boonie, we seldom wear the TC2000 or ACH. Body armor, it's okay in fixed position, not on foot in the mountains.

                  The enemy? I have zero respect for the murderous butchers killing in the name of their G*d, they are less than Rednecks with AKs. The brutality, and disrespect they show seals their fate, with their execution of prisoners and "non believers" they are cowards...so based on my experience I feel I have the right to call them Rednecks with AKs, and cowards.

                  So you missed the point of the article completely, new isn't always great and old is not always useless or a hinder. The principle of LIGHT INFANTRY is it's light and fast moving

                  Take care, friend...Jim
                  "A FAMILY THAT STANDS TOGETHER AND FIGHTS TOGETHER STAYS TOGETHER" The combined Dutch Family...


                  "But I've a rendezvous with Death, at midnight in some flaming town, when spring trips north again this year, and I to my pledge word am true, I shall not fail that rendezvous"

                  Alan Seeger, KIA Belloy-en-Santerre 4 July 1916, Legion Entrangere, American poet.


                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Judging by the folks that contacted me and expressed displeasure over your OP, I wasn't the only one that "misunderstood".

                    And you missed the whole point of my rebuttal. I've read your post so many times I can quote it. It still reads as I responded to. I have an excellent grasp of the English language and some words can only mean certain things. The post is derogatory towards our current military and their actions in the ME.
                    www.precision-applications.com

                    It's knowing that when I get up in the morning and my feet hit the floor, the Devil says, "Shit! He's awake!"

                    Shortly before World War I, the German Kaiser was the guest of the Swiss government to observe military maneuvers. The Kaiser asked a Swiss militiaman: "You are 500,000 and you shoot well, but if we attack with 1,000,000 men what will you do?" The soldier replied: "We will shoot twice and go home."

                    "There are so many Russians, and our country so small, where will we find room to bury them all?" - anonymous Finnish soldier

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Then please delete the post if that is how you read that. It was never intended to be anything but a piece on the old still works. About an old school weapon that does the job just fine without 30,000 dollars of do dads.

                      I never meant to imply one thing about the current serving members of the armed forces. I DID intend to make the statement that there is a very big possibility of a major conflict with REGULAR FORCES upcoming and we are not ready for it. If you read something else into it, I am sorry nothing more was intended. So delete the post, it's that simple. I will not participate in the "dog pile up" of those jumping on the band wagon. Seems when it was posted a year ago some of the vets liked it a lot.

                      Take care...Jim
                      "A FAMILY THAT STANDS TOGETHER AND FIGHTS TOGETHER STAYS TOGETHER" The combined Dutch Family...


                      "But I've a rendezvous with Death, at midnight in some flaming town, when spring trips north again this year, and I to my pledge word am true, I shall not fail that rendezvous"

                      Alan Seeger, KIA Belloy-en-Santerre 4 July 1916, Legion Entrangere, American poet.


                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Yeah, I read it tongue in cheek, took it as simple still works. I took the multicam jibe as a poke at the tactical fanboys. I know a lot of folks have to have all matching camo EVERYTHING. It gets pretty funny. Like the Harley crowd with a logo on everything they're wearing. It is what it is.

                        I didn't get a belittling the troops vibe personally. Can't imagine Jim doing that.

                        "Do the right thing even if it means dying like a dog when no one's there to see you do it." Vice Admiral James Stockdale, NAVY PILOT

                        "Honor, Integrity, Commitment to core values. When they become abstract concepts or "ideals", all is lost." Me.

                        "Character is doing the right thing, even when no one is looking." J.C. Watts

                        "I have never seen a projectile turn in flight and come back at the ship that fired it, I cannot however make that same statement regarding missiles." Me.

                        Deus lo vult! = "God wills it!"

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                        • #13
                          Everyone's had their say and we're all adults (except for Vince), so I don't have a problem with it staying.
                          www.precision-applications.com

                          It's knowing that when I get up in the morning and my feet hit the floor, the Devil says, "Shit! He's awake!"

                          Shortly before World War I, the German Kaiser was the guest of the Swiss government to observe military maneuvers. The Kaiser asked a Swiss militiaman: "You are 500,000 and you shoot well, but if we attack with 1,000,000 men what will you do?" The soldier replied: "We will shoot twice and go home."

                          "There are so many Russians, and our country so small, where will we find room to bury them all?" - anonymous Finnish soldier

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Guys, the way I take it, and if I'm wrong please tell me to sit down, is that Jim is not trying to say that new troopers are wrong , but that you can't forget the basics. When everything goes to hell and the batteries are dead, if you know how to use a map, a compass, a pace count, and the worm formula, you can still get the job done.

                            I've been called a dinosaur by my troops before, and it's a badge of honor for me that I can still do the math, and read the wind without electronics. In the end, it's all about fieldcraft that will keep you alive.

                            Once again, if I've read this post wrong, please forgive me, and I'll fold my tent quietly and go away. Jim, my friend, take care, and my prayers are with you.

                            Stay safe,
                            Mark
                            "It is foolish and wrong to mourn the men who died. Rather we should thank God that such men lived.'
                            --George Patton

                            "Speed's fine, but accuracy is final."

                            There's no such thing as "unfair advantage."
                            11B4HJ3/B4

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                            • #15
                              Mark said it a lot better than I did. Maybe when I hit puberty.

                              "Do the right thing even if it means dying like a dog when no one's there to see you do it." Vice Admiral James Stockdale, NAVY PILOT

                              "Honor, Integrity, Commitment to core values. When they become abstract concepts or "ideals", all is lost." Me.

                              "Character is doing the right thing, even when no one is looking." J.C. Watts

                              "I have never seen a projectile turn in flight and come back at the ship that fired it, I cannot however make that same statement regarding missiles." Me.

                              Deus lo vult! = "God wills it!"

                              Comment

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