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  • The infamous magazine exchange

    For those of you that don't know, or know it by a different name, a magazine exchange is when:

    1. You've been in a gunfight

    2. You are quite possibly unaware of exactly how many rounds you have fired

    3. You want to "top up" your weapon

    4. You want to retain the old magazine out of the weapon in case you need it later.

    This is commonly done by getting the fresh magazine out your pouch and holding it normally (with the thumb-forefinger-middle finger), then removing the partially empty magazine from your weapon with the ring finger-little finger of the same hand and quickly inserting the fresh magazine. The key is to have your weapon be "magazineless" for less than a second.

    There are several variants to this technique, I just described a very common way to perform this. It's also the way that I do it.

    What I wanted to talk about was what follows after you have performed the magazine exchange. What is commonly taught is that the partially empty (or partially full if you're an optimist) magazine goes into a pocket, never in the magazine pouch, because the mag pouch is for full mags only.

    Quite a while back I got to re-thinking this. Let's say the brown stuff hits the oscillating blades so bad that I end up having to eventually load with the partially empty mag I removed earlier. How often to I train to reload from my pocket? Do I always put the magazine in that same pocket? What if I'm wearing different clothes that day and I don't have that certain pocket? Under stress, am I even going to remember that I have a mag in my pocket?

    What I teach now is:

    1. Perform a magazine exchange

    2. "Bump" my good mag to the front of the pouch (if applicable), i.e. the Primary position

    3. Place the partially empty mag in the back of the pouch, i.e. the Secondary position

    Now that rascally mag is exactly where I train myself to load from. If I still have a full mag for a reload, I've moved that mag to the Primary Pos. The partially empty mag is now in the Secondary Pos for an easy reload if I need it.

    Thought I'd throw this out. This is the type of stuff that us Instructors bat around all the time and it came up in a class I taught today. Thought I'd share with all. Enjoy!
    www.precision-applications.com

    It's knowing that when I get up in the morning and my feet hit the floor, the Devil says, "Shit! He's awake!"

    Shortly before World War I, the German Kaiser was the guest of the Swiss government to observe military maneuvers. The Kaiser asked a Swiss militiaman: "You are 500,000 and you shoot well, but if we attack with 1,000,000 men what will you do?" The soldier replied: "We will shoot twice and go home."

    "There are so many Russians, and our country so small, where will we find room to bury them all?" - anonymous Finnish soldier

  • #2
    Good Idea Shep. I like it.
    "Do the right thing even if it means dying like a dog when no one's there to see you do it." Vice Admiral James Stockdale, NAVY PILOT

    "Honor, Integrity, Commitment to core values. When they become abstract concepts or "ideals", all is lost." Me.

    "Character is doing the right thing, even when no one is looking." J.C. Watts

    "I have never seen a projectile turn in flight and come back at the ship that fired it, I cannot however make that same statement regarding missiles." Me.

    Deus lo vult! = "God wills it!"

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    • #3
      I really appreciate the advice. I had seen something similar proposed by Clay from Thunder Ranch on a cable show. Thanks for sharing...very appropriate!!!

      Wayne

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      • #4
        First off, are you using a pouch that just has one big pocket? That is the way I took it when you said bump it to the primary position. Mine is a double mag pouch that holds each mag individually.
        I have tried training that way and I have found that sometimes it is very difficult to get the mag back into the mag pouch when I am in a hurry and facing stress. I think to much time could be wasted there and could get a person in trouble. I shoot a single stack 1911 so a double stack would seem easier since it has a bigger pouch opening. But I definitely see your point of not remembering where you put it and not training with getting that mag out of the pocket if needed. It is kind of a paradox, you want to do it fast but don't want to set yourself up for not being able to find that partially full mag. That is definitely something I need to practice with both ways and see which way works best for me.
        Thanks for tossing the thought out there.
        Lifetime warranty and excellent customer service don't mean a thing when your gun fails during a zombie attack.

        "A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity." Sigmund Freud

        Comment


        • #5
          I use a double magazine pouch that has 2 separate pockets. The Primary position is the front pocket, the Secondary is the back pocket.
          www.precision-applications.com

          It's knowing that when I get up in the morning and my feet hit the floor, the Devil says, "Shit! He's awake!"

          Shortly before World War I, the German Kaiser was the guest of the Swiss government to observe military maneuvers. The Kaiser asked a Swiss militiaman: "You are 500,000 and you shoot well, but if we attack with 1,000,000 men what will you do?" The soldier replied: "We will shoot twice and go home."

          "There are so many Russians, and our country so small, where will we find room to bury them all?" - anonymous Finnish soldier

          Comment


          • #6
            Shep:

            I hate to contradict you, but here's my problem with moving mags around in pouches during a fight. First, your motor skills degrade significantly. Second, you're thinking about so much more than moving them around.

            Personally, if I do a mag exchange, I simply stuff the mag (bullets down) between my waist and pants. Basically where my left hand naturally drops to. Naturally, your waist (or gut) holds it in place even while you are moving. Yet, it is still available, and is a natural draw just like from holster.

            Many, many IDPA competitors do this, and I'm sure IPSC as well. It doesn't waste motion, and once the mag exchange is done, you don't have to think about it any more.

            Not saying yours couldn't work without lots of repetitive practice...but having to first "find" that empty mag pouch under fire could be difficult enough, not to mention how mag pouches will always be in a slightly different position (even 1/4" is a big difference). I don't have to look or find where my gut and pants meet. They're both always there. Just a quick suck-of-the-gut and the mag is in there! And it's ready to deploy again.

            Food for thought.
            Americans sleep well in their beds, because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would harm them.

            Comment


            • #7
              I see problems with both my method and your method. It all comes down to how you train.

              Not saying that Simunitions training is as stressful as a real gunfight, but I have used my method numerous times during "live" Simunitions training.

              I don't see the "fine motor skill" of placing a magazine back into a pouch anymore difficult to do than to seat a mag into the magwell, or break the thumbsnap/retention device on a holster, or hit that little bitty magazine release, or activate the decock lever, or get a good, clean trigger break, or any of the myriad of other fine tasks that we train ourselves to do under stress.

              If you train to do it, and train correctly, then you can do it when you need to.
              www.precision-applications.com

              It's knowing that when I get up in the morning and my feet hit the floor, the Devil says, "Shit! He's awake!"

              Shortly before World War I, the German Kaiser was the guest of the Swiss government to observe military maneuvers. The Kaiser asked a Swiss militiaman: "You are 500,000 and you shoot well, but if we attack with 1,000,000 men what will you do?" The soldier replied: "We will shoot twice and go home."

              "There are so many Russians, and our country so small, where will we find room to bury them all?" - anonymous Finnish soldier

              Comment


              • #8
                I am a little confused, gents. If I understand correctly, we are talking about what I have been taught to call a tactical reload--not a speed or emergency reload.

                My questions and comments:

                1. If in a lull or after a fight, why draw from the emergency/primary pouch? Why not use the secondary pouch to begin with and leave the emergency/primary pouch remain untouched and ready for a speed or emergency reload.

                2. I think two posters mentioned the difficulty of doing this during a fight or under fire. I think, cmshoot is talking about reloading after not during a fight.

                "Our country! In her intercourse with foreign nations may she always be in the right; but our country, right or wrong." - Stephen Decatur, Jr.

                Comment


                • #9
                  shqipe, I've trained myself to sweep the "magazine-grabbin'" hand down to my belt and then back towards my magazine. This insures that I hit the magazine properly to get a good grip, and I will always hit a magazine regardless of where they are in my pouch, i.e., primary or secondary. I'm just grabbin' 'em from front to rear as I need them, not trying to grab a specific magazine. With this method, it doesn't matter where I'm wearing the magazine, or how many I am down, I will always get a magazine.

                  You're correct, I'm talking about reloading during a "lull in the action" or after I have perceived that the immediate threat has ceased.

                  It doesn't make a difference what ya call 'em, I've heard all types of names. The ones I use are:

                  1. Emergency reload: weapon is empty, empty magazine inserted, slide may or may not be locked to the rear

                  2. Tactical reload: round in the chamber, unknown # of rounds in the mag. Drop the mag and replace it with a fully loaded mag. You are not attempting to secure or retain the mag that comes out of the weapon.

                  3. Magazine exchange: round in the chamber, unknown # of rounds in the mag. Remove the magazine from the weapon, insert a fully loaded mag, retain the mag the came out of the weapon
                  www.precision-applications.com

                  It's knowing that when I get up in the morning and my feet hit the floor, the Devil says, "Shit! He's awake!"

                  Shortly before World War I, the German Kaiser was the guest of the Swiss government to observe military maneuvers. The Kaiser asked a Swiss militiaman: "You are 500,000 and you shoot well, but if we attack with 1,000,000 men what will you do?" The soldier replied: "We will shoot twice and go home."

                  "There are so many Russians, and our country so small, where will we find room to bury them all?" - anonymous Finnish soldier

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    intersting to see there's no major differences with the technic learned overhere ...
                    for us relaoding is a drill so movement are the sames under fire or out of fight, the only difference is the speed and the coordination with team members, the very primary rules are less magasines as possibles under the line of the rifle and if necessary the large pouch for empty mags on the 3/4 rear of the opposite.
                    we got ESDT who's a civilian school for it, they'd done few light and easy understandable manual.
                    " IF AT FIRST YOU DON'T SUCCEED, USE DUCT TAPE !" said Uncle Bowe

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                    • #11
                      Bump for review for some folks that may not have seen it
                      www.precision-applications.com

                      It's knowing that when I get up in the morning and my feet hit the floor, the Devil says, "Shit! He's awake!"

                      Shortly before World War I, the German Kaiser was the guest of the Swiss government to observe military maneuvers. The Kaiser asked a Swiss militiaman: "You are 500,000 and you shoot well, but if we attack with 1,000,000 men what will you do?" The soldier replied: "We will shoot twice and go home."

                      "There are so many Russians, and our country so small, where will we find room to bury them all?" - anonymous Finnish soldier

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        [quote]
                        Bump for review for some folks that may not have seen it[/b]

                        Our drill is, when in situations you described, and when in temporary cover, yell out "weapons check!",
                        on wich we quicly pull out the mag, weigh it in your hand (full enough?), reinsert, do a quick round in the chanber check, (pull back the receiver an inch), then confirm to your bud "rifle check o.k.!"
                        Other drills are, on how to stack full mags in your pouch, and used ones, (top up/ or down),
                        and the direction in wich the mag is in the pouch, so when pulled out by one hand, its right to go without looking, to insert in the weapon.

                        greetings from the Dutch, Ad

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