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  • Second strike capability

    When evaluating a handgun for self-defense/combat use, how much importance do you place on "second strike capability"? Please explain why you feel the way you do about it.
    www.precision-applications.com

    It's knowing that when I get up in the morning and my feet hit the floor, the Devil says, "Shit! He's awake!"

    Shortly before World War I, the German Kaiser was the guest of the Swiss government to observe military maneuvers. The Kaiser asked a Swiss militiaman: "You are 500,000 and you shoot well, but if we attack with 1,000,000 men what will you do?" The soldier replied: "We will shoot twice and go home."

    "There are so many Russians, and our country so small, where will we find room to bury them all?" - anonymous Finnish soldier

  • #2
    [quote]
    When evaluating a handgun for self-defense/combat use, how how much importance do you place on "second strike capability"? Please explain why you feel the way you do about it.[/b]
    I don't understand the term "second strike capability". Please explain.
    Here?s to cheating, stealing, and drinking. If you must cheat, then cheat death. If you must steal then steal a young girl?s heart. And if you must drink then have a drink with me.

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    • #3
      Frankly, I never really got that one. Bad round, get rid of it. Why try hitting it again, it's more time lost.
      "Do the right thing even if it means dying like a dog when no one's there to see you do it." Vice Admiral James Stockdale, NAVY PILOT

      "Honor, Integrity, Commitment to core values. When they become abstract concepts or "ideals", all is lost." Me.

      "Character is doing the right thing, even when no one is looking." J.C. Watts

      "I have never seen a projectile turn in flight and come back at the ship that fired it, I cannot however make that same statement regarding missiles." Me.

      Deus lo vult! = "God wills it!"

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      • #4
        The fastes reload is a second weapon!!!!!!
        I stand with Israel !!!!!!!!!!!
        "Dogs best friend"
        "Every dog needs a friend"
        "Tyranny is but a mask that evil wears. Those who fail to perceive it as such, or perceiving it for what it is and deny or ignore it, are destined to be ruled and destroyed by it."
        "Good wife, good sons, good dogs, good guns, what more could one ask of life?
        " 'REAL WARRIORS NEVER CRY ' but it is permissible for their eyes to sweat from time to time"
        " Anyone who doesn't like dogs or guns, is a person never to be trusted!"
        (All the above, Yours Truly
        The only movement to which I want to belong is the bowel movement

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        • #5
          It's not a factor for me; had to Google it to see what it was. If I push the trigger and nothing happens, I rack the slide, get a new round, and continue. With my ammo, I rarely have a FTF, and have never had two in a row. If I did, I'd probably drop the mag and reload.

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          • #6
            I thought you were talking about punching someone, I have always killed them on the first strike.
            " If you want peace,prepair for war "- Imi Lichtenfeld
            '' I don't like to fight, I like to win!" -Me

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            • #7
              Like Vince, as a result of years of training, right or wrong, even when carrying pistols with a second strike capability like my Sigs, I still default to a tap, rack and assess, on a failure; then lock, strip, tap, rack and assess, on the second pass if needed. As a result, second strike is a non issue for me.
              "It's better to live one day as a lion, than one hundred years as a sheep", Old Roman Proverb.
              "For those who have fought for it, freedom has a flavor the protected will never know", Author Unknown.
              "Cry havoc and let slip the dogs of war!", Shakespeare, Julius Ceaser, Act III, Scene I.

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              • #8
                Second strike capability is a term related to semi-automatic pistols. It means that if you pull the trigger and get a "click" instead of a "boom", you can pull the trigger again in an attempt to fire the possibly dud round. You can't do it with striker-fired handguns (Glocks, S&W M&P, etc) or single action only pistols (1911, Browning Hi Power).
                www.precision-applications.com

                It's knowing that when I get up in the morning and my feet hit the floor, the Devil says, "Shit! He's awake!"

                Shortly before World War I, the German Kaiser was the guest of the Swiss government to observe military maneuvers. The Kaiser asked a Swiss militiaman: "You are 500,000 and you shoot well, but if we attack with 1,000,000 men what will you do?" The soldier replied: "We will shoot twice and go home."

                "There are so many Russians, and our country so small, where will we find room to bury them all?" - anonymous Finnish soldier

                Comment


                • #9
                  I don't even consider second strike capability when buying a pistol. If I have a bad round, I am going to dump it and chamber a fresh round.
                  MILSPEC-Measured with a micrometer, Cut with an axe, Beat to fit, Painted to match.

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                  • #10
                    [quote]
                    I don't even consider second strike capability when buying a pistol. If I have a bad round, I am going to dump it and chamber a fresh round.[/b]
                    Well I've never considered it as I didn't even know what it was. As I have both types (hammers and strikers) and always just drill and racking the action to get a fresh round in the chamber.
                    Here?s to cheating, stealing, and drinking. If you must cheat, then cheat death. If you must steal then steal a young girl?s heart. And if you must drink then have a drink with me.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      [quote]
                      Like Vince, as a result of years of training, right or wrong, even when carrying pistols with a second strike capability like my Sigs, I still default to a tap, rack and assess, on a failure; then lock, strip, tap, rack and assess, on the second pass if needed. As a result, second strike is a non issue for me.[/b]
                      Same with me.
                      "I love the Corps for those intangible possessions that cannot be issued: pride, honor, integrity, and being able to carry the traditions for generations of warriors past."
                      Cpl Jeff Sornig, USMC; in Navy Times, November 1994

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                      • #12
                        With my limited experience, ( just a simple grunt), any "click" that develops from a semi auto pistol happens on a FTF (not excluding the one in a million primer failure). The response is tap, rack, bang (assess, as I've seen that called here, but have never heard that.) The other 3 failures; stove pipe, failure to return to battery, and double feed - all experience a mushy trigger and should move into a different level of clearing. Swipe the brass, palm strike forward, punch out bad ammo source and rack, rack, rack - respectively. It takes an empty chamber or a dud primer to produce a click. And i figure I've shot close to 10k pistol rounds and have only seen one bad primer.

                        With that being said, multiple FTF's or double feed's should identity a bad ammo source (mag) and be discarded. When considering a weapon, this really never crosses my mind. I primarily run 1911's and have been constantly chided by jokes of them breaking down. Still have never personally seen that. So in relation to the OP, double stack mags seem to have more feed malfunctions than single stack (in my experience alone) and I will stick with what I know.
                        ?Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everyone you meet."
                        General James Mattis, USMC

                        "It is easy to kill someone with a slash of a sword. It is hard to be impossible for others to cut down."
                        Yagyu Munenori

                        "A man's got to have a code, a creed to live by."
                        John Wayne

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                        • #13
                          Ain't nothing simple about a Grunt! We're the Kings of the Battlefield!

                          Can't win a war without putting boots on the ground.

                          The reason for the change from TAP-RACK-BANG to TAP-RACK-ASSESS is that you need to re-assess your threat after clearing the malfunction. The subject may no longer be a threat and you do not want to automatically fire a shot because that is what you have trained yourself to do.
                          www.precision-applications.com

                          It's knowing that when I get up in the morning and my feet hit the floor, the Devil says, "Shit! He's awake!"

                          Shortly before World War I, the German Kaiser was the guest of the Swiss government to observe military maneuvers. The Kaiser asked a Swiss militiaman: "You are 500,000 and you shoot well, but if we attack with 1,000,000 men what will you do?" The soldier replied: "We will shoot twice and go home."

                          "There are so many Russians, and our country so small, where will we find room to bury them all?" - anonymous Finnish soldier

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            [quote]
                            Ain't nothing simple about a Grunt! We're the Kings of the Battlefield!

                            Can't win a war without putting boots on the ground.

                            The reason for the change from TAP-RACK-BANG to TAP-RACK-ASSESS is that you need tore-assess your threat after clearing the malfunction. The subject may no longer be a threat and you do not want to automatically fire a shot because that is what you have trained yourself to do.[/b]
                            That makes a lot of sense. Gonna go ahead and steal that to put into the vocabulary.
                            ?Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everyone you meet."
                            General James Mattis, USMC

                            "It is easy to kill someone with a slash of a sword. It is hard to be impossible for others to cut down."
                            Yagyu Munenori

                            "A man's got to have a code, a creed to live by."
                            John Wayne

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